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  • The Tories are giving the right wing a really bad name - there is a lot of sensible stuff to be drawn from the right and the only right-alternative is UKIP (lol) so, giving we exist primarily in the centre, there is a lot of opportunity for us to swing right, centre right, and centre votes away from Tories.

    Running with humour = important; I've been having some success with my "Not all Daves are dodgy" line.

    (For reference, I'm mostly centre-left)
  • I hate to say it, but I told you so. Back in June 2015, shortly after I joined, I commented:
    andrew mccallum
    June 2015 Flag
    I have some sympathy with aramoro's point that the Party's structure and policy statement are far too complex for this stage of the party's development. With regard to the paraphernalia of a political party, this needs to be grown as the Party's capacity grows, rather than pulled fully formed out of a constitutional handbook. And does the Party really need to tell people what it would do with tax and national insurance (say) were it to form the next government when it clearly ain't?

    The point of standing in elections (at least at the present stage of the Party's development) can't be to get elected, but must be to raise the Party's profile, get its core values across, and (hopefully) attract more members/supporters as a result. I like the Píratar's clean and concise statement of its Core Policy and Platform, and I think we should be aiming for something of the same. It's the Party's core values and principles that attracted me to it; not its policy on military procurement.

    And, at the present moment in time, does the Party need (and can it realistically fill without dysfunctionality and/or burn-out) a Board of Governors AND a National Executive Committee AND a Leader's Office AND a Policy Group AND a Secretariat AND a Press Office. It may do in the future, but for now wouldn't a single elected steering committee suffice, with an appointed Chair, a Treasurer and a Secretary, maybe supplemented by ad hoc 'juries' of randomly selected Party members to deal with specific issues as and when they arise AND when there's an actual need to deal with them ? - governance partly through election and partly through sortition, in other words.

    I'm keen to see the Party grow, but as I've said elsewhere this is a long-term project that requires careful planning. I think one of the priorities in the short-term is to produce an achievable and realistic development plan that takes into account our present limited capacity and addresses how we can increase it.
    andrew mccallumandrew mccallum
    June 2015 Flag
    I'm also aware that I'm virtually just in the door as a member and that there will be a history to all of this that I don't appreciate. Please don't think I'm just knocking all the hard work that's undoubtedly been done to bring the Party this far. I just fear it might collapse through overstretching its capacity.
    I've been out of the loop for a few months for personal/family reasons, and I've been shocked by what I've found since I started bringing myself back up to speed. We seem to be in meltdown. The Party really needs to get real, recognise the severe limits to its capacity to do all the things it's trying to do to maintain the appearance of being a 'proper' political party, and knuckle down to some capacity-building work. We need to recognise and acknowledge the fact that we have few resources (including human resources - too few people, all of them burning themselves out trying to make the Party function like its fully fledged bigger cousins), take stock of what we do have, set ourselves some (modest) realistic and achievable targets (a strategic plan, if you like), and begin the long one-step-at-a-time process of growing a Party from the bottom up. And I'd suggest we need to have some sort of conference/'away day' to do this.
  • Hello Andrew

    Good to see you are back to being operational - sorry again to hear about your situation.

    Something you may have missed in your reading was the NEC was slowly dying despite the efforts of many to try and gather new people to do work where others left. There are hordes of people pointing out the problems, you need only browse through the forums - and the problems for the most part are well known. Pointing out the problems isn't really what the party needs. It needs people to actually DO something to fix the problems.

    In attempts to fix the sinking ship, those before me and myself were simply told they weren't doing enough and given long winded analysations on what the problems in the party were (we know, duh, we were trying to fix them).

    Given we were fixing a lot of stuff but only getting almost entirely unsatisfactory feedback, most of us concluded the party was unhappy with us and resigned. It now falls to the Board (you) to fix the problems.

    Sorry to lay it all on you on your first day back but I would suggest speaking with your peers on how you personally intend to contribute to the solutions. I myself have returned to the humble and far more simple ranks of being a candidate and doing press stuff. It's nice here. No one shouts at me :)
  • edited April 2016
    I appreciate what you're saying, David. I've been there, done it, and bought the t-shirt in other organisations I've been part of. You volunteer for something and everyone else breathes a big sigh of relief, happy that they don't have to shoulder the load. I just think that the Party has perhaps overreached itself, and that there's a mismatch between its ambitions and the resources it has available to it. I'm aware that a handful of you have been running your backsides off, trying to keep this ambitious show on the road and getting little thanks - and many grumbles - for your efforts. I'm not surprised you guys are feeling scunnered.

    What I'm suggesting is that the Party needs to pause, take stock and consider its future; revisit its foundations and rebuild a more manageable programme, taking realistically into account its actual capacity and the actual resources available to it as a community of interest. I've a bit of experience in facilitating this kind of community development in my paid work, and I'd be happy to take a lead on this in my capacity as a Governor - if there was sufficient interest among the membership. Basically, it would be crowdsourcing from within the membership a strategic plan that could get us from where we are now (which seems pretty dire) to where we would like to be in, say, five years time.
  • Hi ! New member here. I wish I was rich... Then I could solve the pirate party's money problems... neptunes' "sympathy for the devil remix video remix" style... .It's the bit from @3min 14sec in 3:) :wink:
    Unfortunately, though, in reality, I'm pretty broke, eking out my pay from Friday payday to friday payday. So instead of contributing cash, (apart from the very reasonable yearly sub), I'd like to make a few comments/suggestions, to this interesting thread. (Wow, only just signed up and got input to the discussion already, great, fairly unusual for a political party, probably.)
    I voted for the Pirate Party when you had a candidate standing in Westminster. The only "image" problem nagging in my mind, before I looked the party up on the internet, was I thought maybe it's a joke/protest party , or a single issue party, one centred around civil liberties, and internet freedoms, only. The latter are worth fighting for, certainly, but, and I can only speak for myself, I would guess economics, (money, job opportunities/job security, or lack of) are probably uppermost in the voting public's minds.
    So why didn't I join the Labour Party and Momentum? Well I was going to, and then I saw Diane Abbott, John McDonald, Dennis Skinner and Jeremy Corbyn speaking in the park on YouTube.
    Has anyone read Paul Mason's book Postcapitalism by the way? Some of the proposals in that, like basic guaranteed income look utopian, left wing proposals, but actually have support from some right wingers too. (It would cut a lot of red tape in the benefits system out.) Mason suggests paying a dole of £6K a year to everyone, but guaranteeing £20K for those in work, which would make it enough of a difference, and an incentive to work for.
    There are other issues a radical centre party could capitalise on. Sex work is one. There is a big debate ongoing between radical feminists, who favour criminalising clients in an attempt to end demand, and groups like the English Collective of Prostitutes, who favour decriminalisation, so sex workers can work together for safety, without getting prosecuted for brothel keeping. (And obviously, they don't want to end demand anyway, since it's their livelihood.) It's a controversial issue, as many people have honestly felt ethical objections to prostitution, but it might be an issue the Pirate Party could really establish it's liberal/libertarian credentials on. And there's no interest without controversy, sometimes. (The OP mentioned UKIP. I don't agree with him politically, but Nigel Farage is a master at exploiting controversy.)
    Is anyone going to the pub meet up on 20th? I'd be up for a chat if anyone would be interested.
    George (a.k.a. Moriarty)
  • HI George,

    I agree there are a lot of things the Pirate Party should be looking at supporting (Basic Income being one of them). I'd also suggest that at the moment what the Party really needs more than money is time, by which I mean we need volunteers in the Party to help with the running of it. In that regards, policy writing and research is going to be one of those things we need a lot of.

    And yes, I should be at the London meetup on the 20th (after all, I am supposed to be running them).

  • Hi Harley,

    Great! Maybe Basic Income would be a good place to start then? If I get time outside of work, I could see if I can find some research on it, what it would cost/save overall, and could bring it along on 20th, if you and other people might be interested in having a chat about it?( If anyone else wanted to come up with ideas about it, arguments for or against, and pitch in as well then great.) Obviously no worries though if there isn't time in the pub, if there are other things to discuss.

  • ThyPirateDaveThyPirateDave South Wales
    Hello @Moriarty

    We actually have a number of ways we can boost the economy. Take a look:


    A brief however: Radical copyright reform actually allows creativity to flourish and bringing drug research into the NHS with abolishing patents should save us a lot of money. We're the only party that talks about the digital economy and seeing as so much of the online world rests on our postal services, we have a policy to renationalise royal mail - that is until 3D printing is a lot more common at home.

    Regarding the sex industry; I cannot find many areas radical feminists agree. Most of the left wing feminists in politics want to increase censorship of the sex industry and the right wing ones want to clamp down on the internet for fear of children looking at sexual images. Caroline Lucas wanted to ban page 3, Pippa bartolotti also spoke about increasing censorship of the sex industry. I find most feminists only agree (simultaneously) on these two points:

    1) "This image is too sexy, I don't like it. Ban it" (hurts the economy)
    2) "I'm dressed too sexy? Stop oppressing me" (irrelevant to the economy)

    My view here is very simple.

    1) Reducing censorship. Most materials rated 18 should carry a 16 rating. It doesn't make sense that we can have sex but not watch sex. Are we meant to have sex with our eyes closed at 16 and 17? (Boosts economy)

    2) Near complete decriminalisation of the sex industry. Make sex work completely legal and have it regulated like some of the pornography sectors (talents required to have STD checks and carry STD cards to employers etc). (Boosts economy)
  • Problem is the whole "think of the children!" line tends to gel well with voters, whereas "gimme the boobs" doesn't.

    Whilst I'm strongly in favour of what you're suggesting, I worry this might strengthen certain preconceptions about our Party, whether fair or not, about us being predominantly geeky, young males.
  • ThyPirateDaveThyPirateDave South Wales
    Regrettably I agree.
  • Being a new member I can honestly say I found out about the party from seeing the Icelandic parties news on Reuters news service . So me being me I searched for the UK version and here I am , otherwise I fear I would never have found you ! Twitter is dying , Facebook is corrupt so realistically YouTube is a great outlet and has a wider audience , maybe focus on a monthly or even weekly blog ?
  • I like Rolaball stumbled upon the existence of the Pirate Party by chance, in my case a posting by a friend on Facebook asking if I was a secret member. Well I am now and I will not be keeping it "secret". The basic party ethos I am in total agreement with. Within my "life bubble" I see many things wrong with society in the UK and the average deckhand can do very little about it, other than suffer in silence! I think the policies and principles of the party should gel well with population as a whole. But the party needs to be shouting in the media why in but a few years time the UK also has an alternative approach to government and credible competition for the 3 grey party's. We need to get hard on the back of the success in Iceland and blow a few trumpets, loudly. This will garner support and enthusiasm for a change.
  • Our digital footprint is quite large - it's huge for the size of the party we are (17k twitter 10k facebook for a crew of approximately 400). Parties much larger have far less.

    Generally speaking we try to issue press releases when relevant and blog a few times a month but while we have a few members, not enough are active and take on roles needed to keep us in the press.

    We do have some old media on YouTube and re-post to reddit (when we remember to).

    Our youtube channel has currently about 52k views but really does need some new content - again unfortunately time is very limited. Our existing volunteer base cannot work on videos or really do much more than it is already doing.

    If anyone wants to volunteer in any of these areas do let us know. I'm hoping more volunteers will come forward with the success in Iceland - I've been responding to them as they come in.
  • I would be more then happy to get involved in some of these activities, mail me where I might be useful. I have put in a posting of the kind of stuff I have had some experience with.
  • It may be worth putting together some very simple videos with text overlay. I've always found music the problem though, with the way copyright is, especially on platforms like youtube.

    We can fire those out now and then - and in the mean time work on a collection of clips submitted by different members to go towards a larger video that will be used around election time or something.
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